LatinaLista — In the blogosphere he is known as Duke1676. Among bloggers, he’s better known as the analytical author of Migra Matters.
Duke has written and posted at Daily Kos one of the most insightful, certainly most thorough and step-by-step approach into fully understanding the immigration issue.
It’s titled: A progressive plan for immigration reform.
For all who are serious about finding a solution to the problem, we owe it to ourselves to read Duke’s explanation, analysis and recommendations for how to pull ourselves out of this hole that is getting bigger every day — deportations notwithstanding.
Migra Matters’ Blogger Pens Most Thorough Analysis of Immigration Issue
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Comment(30)
Frank
I would have read the whole article but I realized right away that it was full of lies starting right out with terms like “immigrant bashing” and “undocumented people”. I won’t read a propoganda piece full of dishonesty and lies.
miguel
Gone Fishing.
laura
Duke’s is an excellent analysis, though I am not sure as to his practical proposals.
One issue missing from the analysis is the psychology of the “anti-immigrant” and “anti-illegal” individuals. As in all personal and political positions, of course there is a whole spectrum among the “anti-illegals” too. We can examine some exemplars right here on “Latina Lista,” e.g. “Frank,” who appears to have an amazingly large amount of time on his hands to write comments. But aside from the semi-professional haters like “Frank”, how can we understand the emotional motivation of many “anti-illegal” Americans who have never spoken to an undocumented immigrant personally ?
My impression is that many Americans who are suffering from lack of health insurance, crowded schools for their children, job insecurity, and high costs of housing are subconsciously afraid to take on the true causes and perpetrators of their suffering.
For example, for the sake of “fiscal responsibility,” in February of 2006, Republicans cut 40 billion dollars from programs that help middle-class and poor people, such as student loans and Medicaid. In May of 2006, Republicans then gave 70 billion dollars of tax cuts to the super rich.
People instinctively know the enormous power of the richest people in this country, and their ability to hurt anyone who opposes them. For this reason, those who suffer the most, and are often the most angry, fear to direct their anger against the actual perpetrators of their plight.
Instead, they direct their anger against the most defenseless among us. In our age, the most defenseless are undocumented immigrants. African-Americans no longer tolerate scapegoating and violence directed against them. And a majority of all Americans is no longer willing to tolerate hate directed against African-Americans. Undocumented immigrants have no such protection. They have therefore become the easiest targets of the anger many feel about their undeserved existential insecurity.
The very rich have taken vast amounts of resources from middle-class Americans in the past two decades. Of course it serves them well if middle-class Americans direct their anger against immigrants. For this reason, they finance and foster many “anti-illegal” propagandists of whom Lou Dobbs is just one example.
We will not have a chance of actually rebuilding the country for the benefit of all, including the 295 million of us who are not super-rich, as long as so many Americans blame immigrants for their plight, and are afraid to take on the actual perpetrators. But given the emotional ease of blaming the weakest, I do wonder whether change will be possible.
sick-freak
The Dialy Kos!? Give me a freakin break!!!!!
What a surprise that it is all the fault of those evil conservatives.
The accurate term is illegal aliens, not undocumented people.
The problem with Bush is that he has NOT done near enough to secure the boarder.
Let me say again I have no problem with legal immigrants.
You cannot compare the illegal aliens of today with legal immigrants of the past.
Immigrants of the past assimilated to our society.
The current wave of invaders can’t or won’t assimilate.
Diana Joe
the scribblings of the sicko freaks/
“Immigrants of the past assimilated to our society.”
Hey sick freak-you must really be dense-NATIVE AMERICANS in the united states are not “assimilated” and will not assimilate and according to BIG BIG tribal leaders the invaders of the past(YOU) are the immigrants!
Baseball,Hotdogs,and Applepie are not all thats force fed to all of us AMERICANS. We have to live with freaks like yourself that insist on some off the wall assimilation propagandas-it does not stand with Native America!
Some of us still love and defend our mother tonques..right here in the good ol’ USA
Go reinvent your soul wile you have achance freak-you really arent qualifing to be sick.
EYES OF TEXAS
African-Americans are Americans first and African second, if at all. Most of them do not cling to their African roots or tribal culture. The African-Americans are feeling the negative results of the illegal alien invasion more than white America. Once again you are comparing legal American citizens to illegal aliens and that dog don’t hunt. If all the pro-illegal bunch could ever face up to the fact that there are 12-30 million people in this country illegally, with more coming every day, the problem should be obvious.
The Presidental candidate with the strongest policy in solving the illegal alien situation will be elected President. The last poll I saw, 87% of American citizens are against illegal immigration and against our governments handling of the illegal aliens currently in this country.
sick-freak
DJ,
It is great that you love and defend your mother tongue but don’t make me “press one for English” because you won’t learn the predominant (at least for now) language of the country in which you reside.
By the way…I agree with you. If anyone has a right to be pissed, it is the Native Americans, but guess what…they can speak English.
Frank
Laura, I am retired and that is why I have more time to spend on my computer. I only post at most 4 or 5 comments in here a day. I don’t think that is extravagant. The reason you have a problem with it is because I speak the truth and you pro-illegal sympathizers can’t handle the truth.
It doesn’t matter whether I have spoken with an illegal alien or not, it wouldn’t change my mind because illegal immigration is against the law and I know the negatives that are happening in this country because of it. I have nothing against legal immigrants but I am adamantly opposed to those who violate our immigration laws. With most Americans it is as basic as that. The other things you mentioned, illegal immigration does play a role in.
I don’t blame illegal immigration for all of the woes of this country but it is right up there in the top five. Bottom line is that it is against the law and that is the number one reason that most Americans oppose it. Pro-illegals always like to play down that rule of law thingy, don’t you?
Laura
People like me, defenders of the most defenseless, undocumented immigrants, support the rule of law. That is why we want unjust laws to be changed.
Retirees may remember that in 1948, it was illegal in 30 states for an African-American and a white person to marry. In 1967, it was still illegal in Virginia for an African-American and a white person to marry.
These unjust laws have since been changed.
We want to change unjust laws that make it impossible for 12 – or 20 – million people who have contributed hard work to our communities to obtain documents and normalize their standing.
EYES OF TEXAS
Frank, we can keep pounding our heads against the wall with these people, but it will never get any of them to see what you and I see. They are stead fast on their narrow view of the situation because they are defending the actions of themselves, family members or friends that have come here illegally. To the majority of illegal aliens this is just the land of milk and honey and not the United States of America as you and I know it.
The defenses they use for illegal immigration include their ancestral past, racism, distorted historical events and an attitude that laws need to be changed to accommadate their individual situation.
God Bless America and all patriots fighting to save her.
diana joe
Eyes of Tejas..so you began graying and age got the best of you.
Native Americans are not PISSED we’ve had it!
Native Americans speak InLEASH today becuase they were “FORCED” and “BEATEN” pyhsically tortured, and MENTALLY subjugated to ASSIMILATE to WHITE MANS WAY-give ME a GODDAMNED break.
I am so happy to see that you have decided that you and FRANKoff should’nt BANG y’alls heads on these people-and their {The defenses they use for illegal immigration include their ancestral past, racism, “distorted historical events” and an attitude that laws need to be changed to accommadate their individual situation.}
You’re DAMNED right on it when you say we are DEMANDING LAWS to be REVISED and REINVENTED!
LONG LIVE AMERICA HOME OF THE BRAVES!
Frank
laura, here is where your thinking goes wrong. We first have to determine how many foreigners we need right now to do jobs that Americans won’t do for a fair wage. Next we need to determine if we want to continue down the road of massive population growth to fit a huge economy. I favor a smaller population to fit a smaller economy because of the huge demands put on our natural resources, land space, social infrastructures, highways, quality of air, etc.
You want to give blanket amnesty to all 12-20 million of these illegals with no thought to any of the above.
They aren’t defenseless. They have just as much capability of staying in their own countries and seeking change as anyone else. God helps those who help themselves and it appears that they are too lazy to help themselves. It is easier for them to violate our immigration laws with no thought as to how it affects the American people. I don’t call those who lack morality, “defenseless”.
Frank
diana, none of us alive today forced the native indians to speak English. We weren’t even born yet. How about those Spaniards forcing the natives to speak Spanish? Or is it just English you have a problem with?
Don’t speak English or Spanish then. Return to your native languages. Whats stopping you?
EYES OF TEXAS
DJ, Keep smokin’ that peace pipe full of whaky- tabacy to maintain your illusion that things may change to benefit illegal aliens and their supporters. Not going to happen for one major reason; people with your mind set that want to turn back the clock about 200 years. I personally have no sympathy for people that can not conduct themselves in a civil manner and continue to blame the citizens of this nation for all their misfortunes.
Aging is a wonderous thing that brings the wisdom of a life time and a better understanding of what is important in life for the sake of my children and grandchildren. Once you mature a little bit, you too will look back to this blog and realize your rantings were way off base.
Borders, language and culture is, and always will be, my objective and demands for my country. Smaller population means smaller government with less spending on social services that benefit those too ignorant to support themselves. You’re DAMN right on it when you say we are DEMANDING LAWS TO BE ENFORCED and REVISED to clean up the mess this nation has become since 1986.
God bless America, home of citizens only, yet burdened with a government no longer for the people, by the people.
yave begnet
Frank said: God helps those who help themselves and it appears that they are too lazy to help themselves.
I’m sure I have heard this argument before. It doesn’t take long to find with a bit of googling:
Founding Father Benjamin Franklin once sagely observed, “God helps those who help themselves.” He would understand that 400 years of white Americans taking care of blacks has fostered a dependency mindset that is well-nigh unbreakable, especially when our misleaders continue to spend their time and our money encouraging and facilitating that self-defeating relationship.
. . .
it’s so much easier to sit in front of the TV camera and whine — like the woman in Louisiana … like John Boyd … like Phill Wilson … like Jesse Jackson — until some “nice white man” is stupid enough to come along and accept responsibility for your problems.
This is from an article titled “Negroes – America’s Perpetual Basket Case” by one Douglas Olson. Written not in 1946 or 1976 but 2006.
Please explain how leaving one’s home and family and traveling hundreds or thousands of miles to work hard for not much money makes someone lazy. I’ve missed a causal connection somewhere along the way.
We’ve been down this road before. Blacks who worked as slaves and later sharecroppers for white people = lazy. Whites who utilized slave/sharecropper labor = hardworking members of the community.
The story now is the same: Underpaid, overworked immigrants are lazy. Natives who benefit from immigrant labor have somehow been cheated and scammed by these same immigrants.
I don’t understand the reasoning.
yave begnet
The Presidental candidate with the strongest policy in solving the illegal alien situation will be elected President.
I’ll take that as your prediction that Tancredo will win the presidency. I think he was polling around 2% last I heard–and that’s in the GOP, whose generic numbers are way below the Democrats. I suppose anything is possible, but a Tancredo presidency doesn’t look likely.
They are stead fast on their narrow view of the situation because they are defending the actions of themselves, family members or friends that have come here illegally.
Well, actually, no.
The defenses they use for illegal immigration include their ancestral past, racism, distorted historical events and an attitude that laws need to be changed to accommadate their individual situation.
Racism? Against who–my white self? Ancestral past I’ll grant you–Mormons have a history of migration. But that’s true of most Americans–all, if you go back far enough. Even Native Americans immigrated from Asia.
And like Laura said above, unjust laws deserve to be changed. This is not “an attitude that laws need to be changed to accommadate their individual situation”–whose individual situation would that be? My ancestors have been here for 150 years. It’s a matter of principle, which is the opposite of changes to accommodate individual situations.
EYES OF TEXAS
No, Tancredo will not be elected, but other candidates have taken a stronger stand on the issue since American citizens voiced their opinions and defeated the past two mass amnesty bills. Whatever the resolve, neither side is going to be 100% satisfied.
Mormans do not migrate to the tune of 12-30 million over a period of 20 years or so. Also, any Morman migration does not create the same impact on a country as do millions of illegal aliens. Mormans are a solitary bunch that are self supportive and less disruptive to anyone elses way of life. The comparison isn’t valid and an attempt to justify the actions of law breakers.
Would you like to take this migration thing back to the time of Lucy and her tree climbing relatives? Migration has gone on for millions of years, but since the development of borders, laws and modern civilization, the comparison doesn’t hold water. No nation can survive without secure borders, laws to protect it’s citizens, and a government strong enough to enforce said laws.
What gives an illegal alien the mindset to demand anything from a government of a nation that he has no right to be in? Say 100,000 American citizens marched the streets of Mexico City demanding that laws be changed so as to favor them in some way. Sounds very ignorant to me.
Frank
yave, it is lazy because it is much harder for these illegals to stay at home and force their government to change rather than jumping our borders. If Mexicans in Mexico don’t rebel, change will never come about.
Don’t bring up the civil rights era. It has nothing to do with illegal immigration. Blacks were citizens, illegal aliens are not. And don’t put words in my mouth by twisting it to mean that I think that Blacks were the lazy ones, while Whites were not. I didn’t say that illegal aliens who are already here are not hard workers. I am sure many are but that is beside the point. We have a legal way to come here and we have immigration laws.
No, Tancedo doesn’t have a shot in hell to become president. The Republican party won’t even nominate him. But he has kept the issue of illegal immigration to the forefront and that was his main objective.
You of course missed the point of EOT’S post. What he is saying is the the illegal alien sympathizers are using the race card, past indegenous history (distorted and otherwise) as an argument for their support of illegal aliens.
There is nothing unjust about our immigration laws. We take in millions of legal immigrants from all over the world every year. What is unjust about that? What difference does it make how long your ancestors have been here in our immigration policies?
yave begnet
Mormans do not migrate to the tune of 12-30 million over a period of 20 years or so.
Mormons don’t migrate much anymore–but they did once–that’s how most of them got to the U.S. and then got to Utah.
Mormans are a solitary bunch that are self supportive and less disruptive to anyone elses way of life.
That may be the view of many people now, but it wasn’t the view 100 years ago, when sordid tales of human sacrifice on the altars of the Salt Lake temple were entered into the Congressional record, and public sentiment against Mormons–the threatening outsiders of the day, the Muslims or Mexicans of the 19th century–reached a fever pitch.
My point is that history matters, and most people in this country today have a relatively recent history of migration.
No nation can survive without secure borders, laws to protect it’s citizens, and a government strong enough to enforce said laws.
I don’t know, we survived pretty well up until 1986, when the dread IRCA was passed. You see IRCA as an act of treachery; I see it as opening an era of unprecedented punitive enforcement.
Frank
We have had immigration laws since 1920. Every country has immigration laws and borders.
yave begnet
Don’t bring up the civil rights era. It has nothing to do with illegal immigration. Blacks were citizens, illegal aliens are not.
I see some very real comparisons with how deprivation of legal personage leads to marginalization, not to mention that Latino leaders like Cesar Chavez were actually organizing farm workers in the 1960s. More generally, I see the same dynamic of demonization of the outsider at work.
And don’t put words in my mouth by twisting it to mean that I think that Blacks were the lazy ones, while Whites were not.
I said nothing about your opinions on blacks and whites, I just compared your argument about immigrants to longstanding arguments about blacks to show that, in my view, they are both faulty.
I didn’t say that illegal aliens who are already here are not hard workers. I am sure many are but that is beside the point. We have a legal way to come here and we have immigration laws.
For unskilled workers, getting a nonseasonal work visa is virtually impossible. Check out the visa bulletin, “other worker” portion of the 3rd preference category. So when you say unskilled workers should utilize existing laws to enter legally, what you are really saying is that they should not enter at all, because there are effectively no such laws.
Even skilled workers often can’t get visas, since the H-1B category had two or three times the number of applicants as available visas last year.
Unmentioned in the “we have immigration laws” argument is the fact that immigration laws can be rewritten by Congress to fit the needs of the day, they are not written in stone. They should be rewritten more sensibly by Congress now.
Horace
“Some of us still love and defend our mother tonques..right here in the good ol’ USA”
Absolutely, right down to the point you become extinct, like the dinosaurs.
U.S. Amerindians have done so well by adhering to their culture and staying on the reservation.
Horace
“And like Laura said above, unjust laws deserve to be changed.”
Why are our immigaration laws unjust, and who are the illegal aliens that they may have a say in making that judgment? The laws are constitutional and thus just. They’re only called unjust because they’re inconvenient to those who object to them. And who are those that object, but those who violate them.
laura
That is right, “Horace,” the immigration laws are inconvenient to those that object to them.
Like the Venezuelan widow of a soldier in Orlando, who is now facing deportation – along with her son, a US citizen – because her husband was killed in Iraq.
Just like the “anti-miscegenation” laws were inconvenient to couples where one partner was white, the other African-American. As I said above, those laws were the law of the land in Virginia until 1967. And couples who refused to separate were violating the laws.
Just like the denial of the right to vote for women was inconvenient for women. It was certainly the law, and it was constitutional.
Right ?
Horace
“Like the Venezuelan widow of a soldier in Orlando, who is now facing deportation – along with her son, a US citizen – because her husband was killed in Iraq.”
How does this make the law unjust? Who was responsible for this soldier marrying an illegal alien? The government? Should our laws forgive the spouses of soldiers for their transgressions because their spouses get killed? The government didn’t make that soldier’s wife a violator of our immigration laws. Where does personal responsibility for one’s actions take over and big brother government’s leave off? The same situation applies to the son. Who was responsible for putting his family in the position they find themselves in today, certainly not big brother government. Both parents understood exactly what they were getting themselves into when the soldier enlisted, yet the government is now the bad boy because of the actions of the parents.
yave begnet
If you want to make the argument that widows of U.S. soldiers killed in Iraq should be deported, please do. Shout it from the rooftops.
But each court that has heard the issue of the widow penalty has decided in favor of the immigrant–so far, that only includes the 9th Circuit and the Eastern District of NJ, but more suits are in the pipeline. USCIS recently formalized its policy to apply Freeman, which struck down the widow penalty, only within the 9th Circuit. This will only add impetus to the pending suits elsewhere. See ssad.org for more info.
Frank
Yave, what you fail to understand is that the size of our economy has been driven by illegal immigration and that is what “created the needs of today” as you have stated. They themselves created that need not the other way around. An economy driven by mass uncontrolled population growth is not a good thing. We need to scale back our economy to fit a smaller population for all the reasons I have stated in here over and over. Also the availabilty of cheap illegal labor is driving down the wages for blue collar Americans. You might argue that we are saving money on products we purchase but that is just a myth because the employers are just pocketing the profits not passing them onto the consumer. What he is also passiing on to us is the costs of their health, education and welfare in the way of our taxes. Whatever taxes that the illegals pay in do not cover their social costs. It is billions above that. Not to mention how that added population growth affects us in so many other ways negatively.
Horace
Frank is right. All the costs of free health care obtained by illegal aliens are passed onto people like you and I, who suffer the ever escallating rise of health care premiums. For this alone, Americans should object vehemently to the adoption of 20 million in an amensty. If the Hispanic community, the primary advocate of illegal aliens, takes on the responsibilty of paying for any welfare and healthcare costs incurred by their friends, family and others in their ethnic group, it would go a long way in assuaging the fears of the anti-illegal alien groups. I would recommend that any social security payments be made to Mexico and outlays from their treasury be paid for retirement for these people. How many of you Hispanics would be willing to pay additional taxes for to support health care and welfare of illegal aliens? Don’t all speak up at once.
Miche
The same type of people who persecuted the Jews will and are persecuting the Mexicans. Nothing really changes in the world. If it wasn’t for a handful of people with high IQs who lived in the past we would all still be swinging from trees.
I always wonder if Americans living and working in other countries – and they are legion – feel compelled to speak the language of the country they are in (and speak it immediately like we demand of Mexicans) I wonder how many of the Blackwater boys are speaking Iraqi because they are working there..Ignorance has really flourished in this country in the past 25 yrs.
Ryan
As a former U.S. Border Patrol Agent, all I have to say is if an ILLEGAL Alien is an Undocumented Worker then a Drug Dealer is only an Unlicensed Pharmacist.
Most Illegal Aliens are coming here for a better life and wish to work hard. However, their very presence is a violation of Federal Law. Why don’t you wake up and realize that. In nearly every other country in the world the military controls the borders.It is about time our Department of Offense started playing Defense. I support striking terrorists but if we spent and allocated resources for our borders like we do for other activities and enforce the immigration laws like the INAs of the 60’s and 80’s this wouldn’t be an issue. Enforce employer snactions. Take away the wery reason they come here. Zero enforcement in the interior of this Nation shows us we are ignoring the problem. Get the Criminal Aliens out first and then the rest of all the illegals. If they come legally, then welcome them one and all.
Ask the folks who live in border towns how they like burgalries, rapes, gangs, car theft, graffitti,drug smuggling burdened schools and healthcare facilities in their towns. Their businesses, farms, ranches are going bust because of our failure to control our borders.The economies of those communities are crumbling and the rest of America will follow. In a few short years you will experience it yourselves.
It is easy to spread ignorant propaganda about illegal immigartion if Brownsville or San Diego are just as far away from you as Ottawa or Vancouver. Quit enabling your South of the Border Cousins with their addiction to the Dollar and put policies in place that will make them earn their opportunities honestly.
God Bless,
Ryan
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